Pablo Larraín arrived in Telluride on Saturday days after the whirlwind Venice premiere of his latest film Spencer, a genre-bending reimagining of three days in Princess Diana’s life starring Kristen Stewart.
Sitting down with Vanity Fair outside the Palm Theater, he was awaiting what would be just the film’s third screening in front of an audience, as part of this year’s Telluride Film Festival. Jetlagged but excited, he already knew there was no film festival quite like this one. “It’s about really seeing movies and connecting with them,” he said. “It’s just like film therapy, like healing here. Everyone is healing from the last few years.”
Spencer, which is already courting plenty of awards season buzz and favorable reviews, is being described as an “upside down fairytale,” following Diana over a Christmas weekend in the turbulent early ‘90s, when her marriage was collapsing and she was under constant scrutiny— both from the paparazzi outside the estate and the royal family within it.
While there are factual elements to this story, Larraín— who previously made the Jacqueline Kennedy biopic Jackie—is in no way making a traditional biopic. Anchored by a phenomenal performance by Stewart, Spencer (which NEON will release in theaters on Nov. 5) is an imaginative fable of those three days, and an exploration of motherhood and identity inspired by Larraín’s own mother. The 45-year old Chilean filmmaker spoke to Vanity Fair, in only his second interview about the film, about why Stewart was his rock during shooting, how he’s learned to watch his own movies, and what he thinks about how Diana’s sons Prince William and Prince Harry might react to the film.
Vanity Fair: How did it feel to sit with an audience and watch Spencer in Venice and now here at Telluride?
Pablo Larraín: I used to avoid it. It makes me kind of nervous when I’m with others. I become quite nervous. I used to walk out of the movie when the light would go out. But then when we were with Jackie in Venice, Natalie [Portman] said, “You’re staying.” So I did. And then from there and on, I’ve been staying, and it’s beautiful. After the initial panic, it just feels well to experience it and learn from the process.
When did the idea first come to you that you wanted to make a film about Princess Diana?
I grew up looking at my mom being really interested in Diana. And at some point, my brother, who produces everything I do, we thought of maybe doing a movie about Diana and trying to make a movie that my mom would like. And then we got connected with Paul Webster in England. And he said, “Let me see if there’s interest around.” And he calls back and says, “Yeah, there is some.” And we went to Steven Knight, who I was going to make a movie with him but it didn’t work out, but his words and his precision stayed with me. We came up with the concept during a lunch and then he went away, and three months after we had the script. It was really quick.
How did you decide to center the film on just three days in her life?
Well, after Jackie, we learned that just staying in three days with someone, you could probably elaborate a beautiful transformation throughout a very specific crisis.We know that in crisis, we get to know people really well. That crisis was probably just finding her own identity. How do we understand that she was someone that could easily exist by herself and have her own identity besides her marriage, the royal family. And then Spencer came up as a very singular and simple idea. I always wonder what is the last name of the royals? They are members of the House of Windsor and they become “of Wales.” Princess is a title, and then where’s her name? So I don’t know, it’s a big transformation.
Then at the same time, we understood that fairytale that will follow could be very dramatic and tragic, too. And instead of being present in that tragedy and making it part of the story, we felt that it was better to extend it to a more existential type of tragedy. And also what happened is that in the last years, the way that I relate to her memory and her process, it was obviously throughout William and Harry, you know? So I see them, I know who they are. I respect them. And somehow with my limitations, I try to understand them. But I see Diana as a mother, and that’s where we sort of try to understand that we had a beautiful story to tell around motherhood.
One of my favorite scenes is where Diana is playing this game with her sons, in which she’s pretending to be a military captain and they are her soldiers and have to answer her questions quickly and truthfully. It’s so playful and sweet.
You know how that came up? We were casting the boys, and then I started playing that game because it’s a good way to make them improvise and see how they react. It was through Zoom. We saw many, many kids, and then made a shortlist of about three. Then I would go, “Soldier, what is the color of your socks?” And they would say, “Yellow, sir.” And I would say, “What is your favorite club?” And they would say, “Manchester United.” It was so funny and we created something, and I called Steve and I was like, “Steve, can you write it?” So he wrote it, and then Kristen, with both kids, sort of came up with the logic of the game. It’s the only scene of the movie that is half improvised.
How did you end up deciding Kristen Stewart was right for the role?
We discussed other people. We had some hesitations — not for me, from other people financing the work — about having an American actress. And I thought that was obviously a point, but I think that Kristen has that mystery and that magnetism. I saw a movie called Personal Shopper and I loved it, and I didn’t completely understand it because of her. That made me think a lot. I wasn’t really able to inhabit her presence. And when that happens, it goes into a poetic level, I think, in the way that I see it.
So we sent her the script and I was quite nervous to know if she was up for it. And then she calls me and says with her American accent, “Dude, I’m up for it.” And then the process started, and she never, ever during the entire process, not even in Venice the other day or here, not even when she was wearing everything, acting and rehearsing, whatever, she never had fear. Which I did, on a number of occasions because of whatever was going on. Unlike what usually happens, I held on to her strength. She really carried the movie. I of course did my work. I directed it. I conducted the orchestra that becomes a movie, but she’s the force of nature.
You mentioned having fear. Was that specific to this film or in general part of your process?
No, it’s not a specific fear with this movie. It’s just a regular sort of uncertainty that you feel before getting into a movie that, like every movie, they’re just so fragile. Even though you work really hard to organize all the things before, the reality is that a movie gets made in the editing room and everything else is approached to get there. I don’t think fear is the right word. It’s like, it’s just facing that void, that uncertainty of what it would be like. I really think Kristen is kind of a miracle.
The logline calls it an upside down fairytale. Where did that come from?
Yes, which is true and it makes sense. And it’s something that we discussed. Do you know Walter Benjamin? He’s an intellectual. I have to read to you what he said: “And they lived happily ever after, says the fairy tale. The fairy tale, which to this day is the first tutor of children because it was once the first tutor of mankind, secretly lives on in the story. The first true storyteller is, and will continue to be, the teller of fairy tales. Whenever good counsel was at a premium, the fairy tale had it, and where the need was greatest, its aid was nearest. This need was created by myth. The fairy tale tells us of the earliest arrangements that mankind made to shake off the nightmare which myth had placed upon its chest.”
You read this while preparing for the movie?
No, I read this last week. It was not related with the movie. But what I think is beautiful is that we tell fairytales to kids. I have kids myself. [We do it] to create peace and beauty before they sleep and to give them a beautiful and optimistic childhood. But then we grow up and we face the void of adulthood, the fear of the crisis and the problems that we all have. And we tried to survive it. We work really hard to survive those problems. Sometimes they don’t work. So I guess we can all relate to Diana because when she grows up after this fairy tale childhood, she had so many terrible situations. So her life, her fairy tale that was turned into reality, it’s something that is worth a movie, I think.
Many have pointed out how, like Diana, Kristen has had to deal with paparazzi and being in the public eye since she was very young. Was that something you discussed?
No. Never related to her. Never. I understand what you’re saying. We were in the character and extremely focused on that. I will say that since the paparazzi is someone that is far, it’s a long lens culture. So it’s always someone with a very long lens hiding. When you make a movie like this, we had wide lenses up this close, not this close. This close. [Holds hand up two inches from face]. You’re breathing with her and it becomes intimate, and because of that more enigmatic.
When we were shooting, we had paparazzi circling around us all the time, and in England it was terrible. There were some really rude guys that were there, very violent and aggressive people. But Kristen just wouldn’t be affected by it. So I didn’t have to do anything to help her on any level because she had been dealing with it for ages. So she didn’t need me there. I don’t think she needs anyone.
You mentioned the actors who play Harry and William. Do you think about what the real Harry and William might feel, if they see this film?
Look, if they want to see it, we are eventually going to connect with someone that could get it to them. We’ll be happy to show them the movie. I have enormous respect for them and I have a lot of admiration for what Harry has done. But this could be a situation that it’s not easy for them. I don’t know… I wouldn’t want to do anything that would just create any kind of problems. They’ve had enough. I don’t want to add anything else. I did this movie out of respect and love for their mom and for my mom. It’s a mom’s movie.
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